#91: The 10-Year Motivator | Jacob Rodman on Confidence, Finance, and What Stuttering Builds
“If I can talk to a girl I like and a global head on Wall Street, I can talk to anybody.”
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Jacob Rodman is 20 years old. He can talk to anyone.
He's a junior at Northwestern. He interns in private credit and distressed investing. He runs a mentorship program for young people learning finance. He launched a stuttering support program at his old high school.
And last year, he stuttered his way through a 45-minute Wall Street interview and ended it with something so good that the executive across from him couldn't shake it.
He calls it the "10-year motivator."
Here's what makes this conversation different. Jacob didn't arrive here overnight. His speech got stuck at 7. His parents sheltered him - lovingly, responsibly — through childhood. He wasn't aware of the full weight of it until 14. He wasn't ready to do the real work until 18. And here he is at 20, doing things his 10-year-old self would not believe.
That arc - not ready, then aware, then ready - is one of the most honest things about this episode. And one of the most useful for every parent, every clinician, every person who stutters wondering why progress feels slow or why someone they love isn't engaging yet.
People get ready at different stages. The work can't start until they are.
EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS
In this conversation, Jacob and I explore:
The 10-year motivator — In a Midtown conference room, facing a global head who gave him "the look," Jacob ended the interview by turning to the executive and telling him something about what it means to look back 10 years. The kid who couldn't order food at a restaurant would not believe this moment is real. That gap is the fuel. "What can I do when I'm 30? That's what gets me up every morning." Every leader needs this frame.
When to step in. When to step back. — From age 7 to 14, Jacob's parents ordered for him, said his name for him, ran interference. That protection was the right call then. But there comes a moment where protecting becomes limiting. Jacob's parents found it. They eased him into ordering at restaurants. Then drive-throughs. Then college. Then Wall Street. Knowing when to step back is one of the hardest and most important things a parent can do. This episode shows what it looks like in real life.
Not ready at 10. Aware at 14. Ready at 18. — Jacob was sheltered through most of childhood. It hit him at 14 — the bad hand feeling, the why me, the frustration that nobody around him truly understood. But even then, he wasn't ready to do the deep work. That came at 18. He walked into therapy in a hoodie on a 90-degree July day, covering his college name so no one would ask where he went to school. That's where the real work started. Readiness isn't a switch. It's a process.
"I didn't want it to be the first thought" — At 18, Jacob told his therapist what he wanted most. Not fluency. Just to stop the stutter from being the first thought in every room. Two years later, a 100-person networking event. Nice suit, nice tie. He didn't think about his stutter once. "It's not anymore. Which is huge."
The invisible burden — Everyone thinks it's the big speeches. It's ordering food. Saying your name on the first day of school. Your favorite Netflix show. Ordering pasta with red sauce and getting something else because you couldn't say it. The daily tax that nobody sees and nobody talks about.
The Starbucks experiment — Jacob's mom would order for him, prep his sentences, cover for him constantly. Loving. Well-meaning. And not fully seeing the whole picture. So we taught her to stutter at a Starbucks. She was anxious on the 10-minute walk over. In line, she wanted to bail. She shelled in, did the smallest little stutter. "She did it for five minutes and she was shaken. I have to do it every single day." That was a turning point for both of them.
100 calls in less than 100 days — Freshman year, Jacob set a goal: 100 finance networking calls. He started mid-January, crossed it mid-April. He stuttered on call 1. He stuttered on call 100. Spring break: five calls a day, every day. First 30 calls: anyone who'd say yes. Last 60-70 calls: private credit leads, MDs, partners giving him an hour, sometimes two. "From call 1 to call 100, I got drastically better." The stutter didn't leave. Something else got built.
The date story — Thursday night. He's with a girl he likes. Getting late. He tells her he has to leave — speech therapy in the morning. She was surprised. He explained. She laughed it off. He saw her again. "If I can tell a girl I like that I have speech therapy, and if I can talk to a global head on Wall Street, I can talk to anybody."
"Lay the bricks" — You don't have to know how you're going to build the wall. You just have to lay one brick. "I can guarantee there are going to be days you feel like you're getting nowhere. Endure. The ability to go through long-term suffering and pain with little to no negative change. That's what stuttering teaches you.
TIMESTAMPS
00:00 - Jacob Rodman: youngest guest ever on TranscendingX
01:05 - What doesn't show up on his resume or LinkedIn
03:12 - PANDAS at 7. And the start of stuttering.
06:22 - Where Jacob is now: Northwestern, Economics, and the path forward
06:34 - The "10-year motivator": the Wall Street interview that changed everything
09:38 - Age 7-14: sheltered, protected, not yet ready
11:34 - Age 14-15: when it started to really land
13:40 - The invisible burden: the little things nobody sees
19:15 - 7th grade: the teacher who replayed the stutter in front of the class
25:23 - His mom found out. What happened next.
26:16 - The turning point: when his parents stopped ordering for him
28:00 - "I didn't want it to be the first thought when I walked in a room"
31:56 - The hoodie on a 90-degree day: what Jacob was hiding at 18
32:30 - The Starbucks experiment: teaching mom to stutter
40:08 - 100 networking calls in less than 100 days
44:38 - What their work together actually built
44:51 - The date story: telling a girl he liked that he had speech therapy
46:43 - "Lay the bricks": Jacob's word for anyone on the fence
50:11 - Where Jacob's going in the next 10 years
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ABOUT OUR GUEST
Jacob Rodman is a junior at Northwestern University majoring in Economics. At 20, he interns across distressed investing, private equity, and credit-focused hedge funds. He runs a finance mentorship LLC and launched a stuttering support and mentorship program at Sacred Heart University for students who stutter, focused on building confidence, communication skills, and community. He's also a competitive long-distance runner.
ABOUT OUR HOST
Uri Schneider, MA CCC-SLP is the founder of Schneider Speech - leading a boutique practice of specialists treating stuttering and communication disorders. He's also an executive coach focused on communication and leadership, helping individuals and organizations see the invisible patterns slowing them down.
With 25 years as a clinician, business leader, and former faculty at UC Riverside School of Medicine, Uri connects science, business, and real-life experience to show how better communication helps us think more clearly, decide faster, and take stronger action.
Uri hosts the TranscendingX podcast to reveal how everyday people transcend adversity - listening for what's not being said and making the invisible visible.
Uri lives with his wife and four kids. When he's not working, you can find him running outdoors.
Schneider Speech: schneiderspeech.com
Coaching with Uri Schneider: urischneider.com
FULL TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:00] Jacob Rodman: I wasn't so confident when it came to things prior. And that's the big reason why I came to you and. I had a date.
I was able to tell a girl that I was trying to impress that. Like, I, hey, like I had to go, 'cause I, I've got speech therapy in the morning.
I think that was a big moment that I didn't internally like recognize is that like my confidence grew that much If I could tell a girl that I like and if I can talk to a global head on Wall Street I can talk to anybody.
[00:00:26] Uri Schneider: Wow. This is an episode you don't wanna miss with Jacob Rodman. We'll start off talking about the 10-year-old boy that couldn't get his words out.
He was dealing with PANDAS, he was dealing with stuttering, and today he's doing networking events and interviews in finance. He's only 20 years old, but what he is accomplished in the past 10 years is unbelievable, even to himself. And it also shows the promise of what's possible in the next 10 years for him and what's possible for all of us.
So don't miss this episode with Jacob Rodman.
What's, what's something you think people should know about Jacob Rodman that they wouldn't see on your resume or your LinkedIn?
[00:01:05] Jacob Rodman: Hmm. Resume LinkedIn. I think one thing that I wanted to point out, and I don't know if this is, if this is true or not, am I the youngest person to be on the podcast?
Ooh. I was. I was looking around and very accomplished people that, you know, have stuttered, still stutter. Just curious. So
[00:01:21] Uri Schneider: far you fit, very accomplished people who may stutter, uh, you might be the youngest. Yeah. All of just one
[00:01:28] Jacob Rodman: little thing that I wanted to maybe point out or wanted to see, wanted to ask.
So
[00:01:32] Uri Schneider: when was the first time I told you your podcast material?
[00:01:36] Jacob Rodman: Podcast material? Like I
[00:01:37] Uri Schneider: said to you, one day we're gonna record a hundred percent.
[00:01:40] Jacob Rodman: Um, so a little backstory, like I started working with a year program when I was very young with Becca, right? Was was Becca when I was. Can't pinpoint. Seven, eight years old, maybe, maybe a little older, 10, somewhere around, and then started to really work hands on with you.
When I was going to college my freshman year,
[00:01:57] Uri Schneider: did you ever meet with my dad?
[00:01:58] Jacob Rodman: Yes, I met with your dad. I've met him several times. Um, and then
[00:02:04] Uri Schneider: I, I, I told him we were meeting today. Yeah. And he pulls up his notes. Yeah. He's like, Rodman, I know that name. Yeah. Most people think of Dennis Rodman. Yeah. But Rodman.
And he pulls out his phone and like, God bless, he pulls out and he is got like a hole. A whole thing on you and your parents and the meeting. And I'm like, dad, I thought you met him the first time at that event we did at hud co. At Hastings on the Hudson. That movie screening. Yeah, of course. And he's like, no, no, I met him here in this date.
And I'm like, oh my goodness. Yeah,
[00:02:34] Jacob Rodman: I must have met him when I was younger. My mom's always got the kind of thing going. Yes. Connected me with you. And, um, I've definitely met him a couple times here now, so yeah. So you met
[00:02:46] Uri Schneider: be your memory, goes back to meeting him, and then you met Becca who was working with us.
Sure.
[00:02:51] Jacob Rodman: That was, I, I was very young, was kind of when I was like, first getting into stuttering I guess per se, and um, kind of trying to like, work through the kinks of it and just understand what was really going on. Uh. You're the stuttering expert, so, you know, I might be wrong, but No,
[00:03:07] Uri Schneider: no, I'm, I, I just do a lot of work.
Of course, yeah. People stutter, but you're much more of an expert.
[00:03:11] Jacob Rodman: Yeah. So I started studying when I was seven years old, so I didn't stutter my whole life and definitely a part of my life where I, I remember, not stuttering, but it's been, I'll be 21 in February, so it's been, you know, right around 14 years now and started working with her maybe right after I started stuttering a little bit after their year or two.
Um, I remember being young and I think. With the stutter, like not being born with it or not having it kind of fade. A little, a little background. I was diagnosed with a disease called Pandos, and I don't want to get too into it, but it's, um, I was seven years old. Very extroverted kid, going out with my friends, you know, having fun like on the playground in school.
My mom's very extrovert. I think I kind of picked that up from her and I, I like to describe it in this way and it's a little pessimistic, but. I felt that it was, I was seven years old and within a week span, I, it was very hard for me to speak. I virtually couldn't speak and it's a, that, that's a weird thing to grasp for a child, to be fully fluent, having fun doing what a kid would do, and then a week later, you know, really struggling.
My parents not knowing what was going on. I'm too young to kind of really understand everything and. I describe it as your voice getting taken from you. Like it's something that I love so much. I love to go out and talk to friends in the playground and whatever a first grade second grader would do, and then not being able to do that.
So starting to work with Becca. I think my parents were very protective over me when I was younger and wanting to just give me the best care and try to, and ultimately fix something that they. I didn't know what it was. They were really confused. It's their first time I was their first born having a kid.
And I think the parental or total instinct of like, my mother was like, let's fix this. Let's, let's bring 'em everywhere. Let's go talk to these doctors and everything. And it's kind of how it started. And you know, I've been stuttering now for a large portion of my life, so there's a lot more that has came with that.
But when I was young, it was really an internal battle of kind of feeling out like what was, what, what, what? What really was the stutter? Why did I stutter? And all these kind of things that is, you know, difficult for a child to grasp, let alone anybody. So, yeah, it seems kind of, you know, little background into it.
[00:05:33] Uri Schneider: Wow. And where are you now? What are you busy with these days?
[00:05:37] Jacob Rodman: So, I'm in college. I'm a junior in college, majoring in finance. I mentioned that 'cause that's a, a large portion of my life kind of right now. Um, and. Things are great. Very busy. Love to be busy. I think it's a privilege to be busy. Um, and focusing on academics, that's a big part of my life.
Internships, interviews, and we can kind of, uh, merge in that as well, if you'd like. And you know, just doing what every other 20-year-old, you know, mostly is doing, you know, focusing on the career path. You got friends, you got family that you, you know, home with right now. Um, just trying to take advantage of like all opportunities and.
You know, that's kind of where my head's at right now is just kind of pushing forward, figuring out what, what I'm gonna do, uh, the areas that I'm interested in, the financial sector and route and yeah.
[00:06:22] Uri Schneider: If like, um, eight, nine, 10-year-old Jacob would run into you today
[00:06:28] Jacob Rodman: Yeah.
[00:06:29] Uri Schneider: And find out what you're up to and what you're thinking.
What would he say?
[00:06:34] Jacob Rodman: So this is a phenomenal point that you're bringing up. I was going to bring it up later in the episode if you asked any advice for any kids or anything. But I think it's the forefront now, and I think it's important. There's something, I don't have a definite name for it, but it's a 10 year motivator, I guess.
That's a a great example. And here's a little background. This story, I was in an interview in Midtown for an internship position for summer 2026. I was in a conference room with a global head. I don't remember what desk or what team he was on, but nice guy, nice enough guy, but intimidating, you know, senior guy in Wall Street, walked in, had my resume, nice suit on, and went through the whole interview.
It was maybe 30, 45 minutes and my stutter was rough. It, it was, it was, it was present. I was able to still get across when I wanted to get across. There's a, a look, you kind of see when the, look, there's, it's a famous look and you get the luck and it's this uncomfortable look, they don't want to be there.
You don't wanna be there. I've been stuttering my whole life. You, us, the
look,
it's
kind,
it's, it's, it's so anyone that's listening will know the luck and it's like they get it their whole life through everybody that they speak with. And it's just an uncomfortable kind of, I want to help, I don't know how to help kind of thing.
And I, I don't know how I pivoted to it, but it was the last part in the interview and I. Kind of on a whim, did a little mode, like a motivational speech with him. And I was like, listen, I wanna tell you one thing, and is if you have a camera, TV screen, any sort recording what is going on right now and showing myself 10 years ago, he wouldn't believe what it was.
He, he wouldn't believe that I'm able to, that I'm able to sit here with you, articulate my thoughts, talk about my resume, breakdown everything, and really try to present myself and. Really sell myself to you. He wouldn't believe it was true like he would think there's no way a kid that couldn't speak didn't have the confidence to go out and to do anything, let alone order food at a restaurant would now be able to talk to a global head on Wall Street and impress him.
And that's the 10 year motivator. 'cause look where I'm at now and that motivates me. What can I do when I'm 30? Mm-hmm. You know? You know where rolling it forward, where can I now be in 10 years? And I think that's what gets me up every morning is like understanding. I've went. From a kid that couldn't speak without confidence to now being able to be on a podcast.
I think that's a, you know, a huge turning point. And I, and I think that just motivates me of like, what can I do when I'm 30? Maybe I'm on a huge panel, maybe I'm running a team, maybe I am. And it is just, there's a, there's, there's a whole array of things I could be doing. And I think that's the motivation is like, where, what, what could I be doing in 10 years that would make my present self be astonished me proud of like the person that I've now.
You know, just be calm at 20, 30, 40, and you know, onward. So that's kind of where it comes from. Wow.
[00:09:25] Uri Schneider: So we're seeing you today a hundred percent. Again, a little taste of what might be coming up in 10 years. Yeah. I'm inspired and challenging myself to think of what I can bring on in 10 years. But tell us a little bit more what it look like.
Yeah. Age 10. What would we see?
[00:09:38] Jacob Rodman: Age 10, I think. Um. Does it? Some
[00:09:43] Uri Schneider: kids, some kids stutter. They really carefree about it. Yeah. Some kids have everything else in life is clicking. They just got this issue and frankly they don't wanna be bothered by it. Yeah. And their parents are concerned, but like, leave me the hell alone.
Like, I got bigger fish to fry. Yeah. Better things to go after. And some people, it actually starts to really, uh, really put them down. Yeah. Be a really big albatross and be a really big weight.
[00:10:08] Jacob Rodman: I think when I was. As you said, like 10 years old. I think from seven to around 14. My parents sheltered me a lot from it.
Spent a large amount of childhood, like in doctor's appointments and trying to figure out the disease part of what was going on. And
[00:10:20] Uri Schneider: the pandas,
[00:10:20] Jacob Rodman: yeah, the, the pandas and getting blood tests and different exams drawn and meeting with, you know, experts in the field. And it was a. A rare disease and something that isn't common.
It's, it's more common in children and males, but it um, just a side
[00:10:33] Uri Schneider: point, we have an episode with per um Okay. A LM per um, yeah, Dr. Per, um, and he has some great research on Great
[00:10:41] Jacob Rodman: pandas. I'll watch, could check out that episode. Definitely. Yeah. And I felt sheltered majority of like my childhood and I think my mother is sheltered from what I think the fear of like stuttering.
I think my mom. Especially my mom wanted me to, you know, have a normal childhood to the extent that I could. And I think you're forced to mature very early when you have something like that, like being in ands
[00:11:05] Uri Schneider: or the stutter.
[00:11:06] Jacob Rodman: I think both. Um, but you're put in very adult settings and you have to handle things that kids frankly shouldn't have to handle.
And I think there's pros and cons to that, but
[00:11:15] Uri Schneider: like, what did she, what do you think she spared you from?
[00:11:20] Jacob Rodman: The embarrassment of when she could control, like when I'm in school, there's not much you can do but outta school, especially when you're a kid, you're with your parents a lot and ordering at restaurants and going out and saying My name for me,
[00:11:31] Uri Schneider: what you do, saying your name for you.
Yeah. Ordering for you,
[00:11:34] Jacob Rodman: ordering for me, and doing all those kind of things that, you know, I was fearful of. And I think it started to really hit me when I was 14 of when I became more present of like the world. I was definitely present when I was younger. Not really cerebral enough to like, understand what was really like going on.
And when I was 14, 15, it really hit me hard. And I think, uh, another like pessimistic approach that I had when I was younger is like, I felt that I was dealt a bad hand and the most important game. And it's like the game is life. And I was like, why did it have to be me? Why do I have to be the one that has to, you know, just suffer from a day-to-day basis And no one else seems to understand why.
Everyone wants to relate to the person that stutters when you don't stutter. They're like, I get it. And they just don't. And that's a frustrating internal feeling, like knowing that they, they do care and they want what's best for you, but they'll never know what it's like to go up to a drive-through and not know how to say, I want, you know, a, you know, like a Big Mac with fries and, you know, everyone thinks that's like the most, the most normal thing.
And to go up to. Just be at a restaurant and wanting to get a pasta with red sauce and getting something different because you can't say it and you don't really want to eat that. And it's like the little internal things that people don't realize. Like everyone thinks it's the big speeches and the presentations, and of course it is, but it's, it's, it's just the little things of saying your name on the first day of school and saying where you're from and your favorite Netflix show and the things that just.
So trivial and don't actually matter in the meaning of life, but it's like, I really care. It's like, why does everyone need to know what my favorite Netflix show is? Like it's not gonna change who I am. And it started to really hit me at 14. I
[00:13:13] Uri Schneider: I remember when you were going for your freshman year in college.
Yeah. And it wasn't even, it got to a point where it was hitting you, like not even just talking, but. There was like group texts for all these coming freshmen, and I'm like, why don't you like introduce yourself there on the text message group. It's great. Yeah. I don't know. I don't wanna put myself out there like that.
I'm like, why? Like, I don't know. But then they might wanna talk to me.
[00:13:33] Jacob Rodman: Yeah.
[00:13:34] Uri Schneider: And I think that you don't realize how a hundred percent, like you said, they think of the big speech moments. And
[00:13:39] Jacob Rodman: I think that highlights like a good point is like when you have a study, you're kind of forced to take a backseat on a lot of roles.
Like I was. The, the kid that wanted to be the center of attention and have everyone laugh at my jokes. And I think this pairs into something nicely that it's, it gave me the, the ability that when you are the center of everything, you're not understanding really what's going on around you. Hmm. You're dealing with, you know, how can I speak, how can I impress the people around me?
And I think when you're forced to, to take a back burner and kind of a backseat on the situations, you understand what's really going on in a room. You understand? Like
[00:14:15] Uri Schneider: what do you, what do you tune into that you feel you wouldn't otherwise?
[00:14:17] Jacob Rodman: I think like the emotional output of like what people are giving you, how people react to certain situations and you know, doing that over the years of, you know, being forced to kind of be like, okay, hey, like I gotta take this back burner seat.
I need to kind of analyze what's going on and maybe I could add input here and there, but I no longer am able to be the, the face of attention. I think there's, there's a lot of pros in that. Getting able of just being able to read the room. Yeah, a hundred percent. Just read the room to people. And I've used that skill in life now in interviews with people in classrooms and settings, and I wouldn't have had that if I didn't have the stutter, um, even
[00:14:53] Uri Schneider: in that interview.
Like knowing the right moment Yeah. To throw in that motivational speech, knowing if it was the right person, the right moment.
[00:14:59] Jacob Rodman: Yeah, definitely.
[00:15:00] Uri Schneider: And of course having that in your back pocket. Yeah.
[00:15:02] Jacob Rodman: And I think, I think one good example of this is that I was in. A partner's office in Jersey City. They have a nice, like, like Jersey City is doing some really, really great things in the financial industry sector, just to kind of say, and they have got some really pretty buildings and everything.
So I, I, I had a meeting in there with a partner in private credit, which is the area that I like a lot. And we, he walked from, he walked me from the front to his office. It's a four floor office, kind of inter merg with each other. It's very fluid. It, it looks very nice. Everything in there was new and it's beautiful.
And I noticed it and I was like, I would love to be here. Like this seems like an environment that you'd want to come to every day and work. And just from analyzing the room, I said to him, he gave me a, a large amount of his time, maybe an hour, hour and a half of his time, which is rare for anybody, and especially someone that's that senior.
And uh, I was sitting with him and I was like the, I was saying the environment that you're in right now, uh. Just the landscape of everything, the open window, like kind of floor plan, just everything that was going on. I want to be here every day and it forces me to work harder 'cause I don't want to be kicked out.
I don't want to leave. Mm-hmm. And getting, and just being able to understand the people around and how they interacted with one another. And it's, I don't think you would understand that if you didn't have a Sutter and it, I don't think I would've been able to develop that school. I that, just that overall skill if I was the front of attention throughout my whole life and.
That's something that I think he appreciated was like, okay, like this kid's noticing these little things that I maybe haven't even noticed. Um, I had an interview for a college that I went to, and it was to get more scholarship money and they said, what is one thing you like about this school? Everyone's gonna say that educational program and this or that.
I was like, the landscaping. The landscaping is beautiful. You've got fountains, you've got flowers, everything's perfectly correlated. They're like, what? No one says the landscaping. I was like, the landscaping here is so beautiful that it makes me wanna come to class and it makes me wanna stay here and work harder to be here.
And I think that's just something that like sticks out. Everyone's gonna say that they love this or that and to say, you know, stereotypical five answers and I kind of went out of the box and notice something that is so, so obvious to see, but no one was gonna mention. I think that's something that I've gained from having to take that backseat in roles and you know, yeah.
With my speech. Wow.
[00:17:26] Uri Schneider: Wow.
What was the dumbest, what? What, what was the most, what was the most painful or challenging memory you have in those years of the stutter in those earlier years?
[00:17:38] Jacob Rodman: Yeah. I think a lot of people, you see the movies growing up that like the big bad bullies gonna bother you and is gonna pick on you for a disability or for something that isn't completely normal.
I never suffered with that. Had amazing friends and. Great people around me, uh, parents and educators and and administrators have kind of been the blunt force of like, the trauma per se. And
[00:18:03] Uri Schneider: just to, just to set the stage, we're talking about like what your stutter was like then was like, it was always noticeable.
It showed up sometimes
[00:18:11] Jacob Rodman: when I was younger, I was seven to 11 years old. It was pretty, it was very hard for me to communicate, um, sentence, you know, conversations that should take 30 seconds would take me three minutes. Um, it was very, it was very visibly there and it was nothing I could do to avoid it.
[00:18:29] Uri Schneider: Did you say what you wanted to say or you felt like half, I could even express a
[00:18:32] Jacob Rodman: fraction sometimes get out some things, but, um, I definitely didn't go on, you know, long tangents about my feelings and everything. Yeah. So you
[00:18:40] Uri Schneider: didn't, you didn't have the freedom to fully express yourself
[00:18:42] Jacob Rodman: a hundred percent.
Yeah.
[00:18:43] Uri Schneider: So you're saying that friends were not, the problems were not the problem. People that are worried like, oh my gosh, he's gonna become this age, he's gonna get tormented. Yeah. Like maybe, maybe not. But you're saying the people that gave you the hardest time were adults, parents, teachers. Yeah.
[00:18:57] Jacob Rodman: And I think those are the people that you think wouldn't the, you would think they know better.
The people that are supposed to educate you and protect you and you know, comfort you and I had some amazing professors. I've had amazing professors. Now I've got amazing teachers and people that really were great to me. I think, what's one thing
[00:19:12] Uri Schneider: that stands out? One, one experience or one
[00:19:15] Jacob Rodman: seventh grade, I had a, we were practicing our presentations for something.
I strongly dislike presentations. Still to this day, it's not my favorite thing to do. And we were practicing them for the final presentation date next week, and the teacher had the grand idea to record all of our presentations. He wanted to record them all and show them to the class and highlight the things that we could do better for our main presentation day.
So maybe it's a great idea. In theory for me, I was like, what is going on? This is the worst thing that could have happened to me. Presentations
[00:19:47] Uri Schneider: you just 10, Xed it a
[00:19:48] Jacob Rodman: hundred percent and it was. Like if anything could go wrong, this would be the issue. Like he's gonna record it and play back it over and over and over again for the class.
And I think frankly, maybe an adult should understand that probably wasn't the best situation, but it's okay. I did it and he played it back many, many times for the class and highlighted what I did wrong, majority of which was my speech, and I had to like relive that moment over and over and over again.
I had some great friends in the class that went home and told their parents, and I think they were 12 years old, and understood that this probably wasn't the right thing to do.
[00:20:24] Uri Schneider: So he replayed it and actually like, cut you down.
[00:20:27] Jacob Rodman: Cut me down every, every blip. Every or stuttering. Yeah. And highlighted every, every blip and every stop.
And this
[00:20:36] Uri Schneider: was not in like an unsophisticated. You know, underprivileged kind of area.
[00:20:41] Jacob Rodman: No, this is a very,
[00:20:42] Uri Schneider: we're talking about like a place where you Yeah. Would think these things wouldn't happen. Yeah. But it just very nice classroom. Very, these things can happen anywhere. Mm-hmm. And the, and the best of things can happen anywhere.
[00:20:52] Jacob Rodman: Yeah. And he was known in the school as one of the best, one of the best teachers. People loved him. He got see it coming. Yeah. He's got great, you know, reviews. Everyone wanted to have him as his English literature teacher. I remember he was. And. I've got no animosity towards this guy. I don't, I don't think he intended to cause me any malice or any like
[00:21:11] Uri Schneider: you think it was ignorance or malice?
[00:21:16] Jacob Rodman: Probably ignorance. Okay. Um, that says more about you. I hope so. Okay. And so he replays it? Yeah. And he's kind of cutting it down like three to five times. And it was short. Maybe it was a minute and a half, two minutes. Just broke down every moment of like when I would stutter.
[00:21:30] Uri Schneider: It stuck with you for more than a minute and a half?
[00:21:32] Jacob Rodman: Yeah. Like I had to be up there for a minute and a half, which felt like 10. And then you had to play it over and over again and highlighted everything for the class of what they shouldn't do and how I should improve for the main presentation day. And I sat there and I just kind of took it and my mom came in like a mama bird kinda laugh.
You just sat there, you took it. I went on through my day. I went to my next class, and I, I, I, I understood that it was messed up. I understood that, that, like, that really wasn't cool. Um, I was 12 years old. I don't really know what, like, the emotions I was feeling were, but I was like, yeah, probably wasn't right.
And it upset me. I didn't wanna do the presentation to, to begin with. And now we highlighted all the things that I, I couldn't work on and I couldn't change at that moment in my life. And I was going to stutter regardless if you told me to or not to. And it was embarrassing to be around your friends and your peers and the people that care about you, and to constantly show you something that you don't wanna see.
Um, I didn't tell my mom, uh, a friend named Hannah.
[00:22:38] Uri Schneider: So you didn't have someone to go to in school? You could tell to No. And you didn't tell your mom or your dad?
[00:22:45] Jacob Rodman: Why not? I think I was just not used to these kind of things, but like, like I have tough skin. Like I've, I've been stuttering at that point for five to six years, and it was like, I was
[00:22:59] Uri Schneider: Did you feel like you, it was like a feeling of like you were supposed to be able to shoulder this yourself, or like you didn't think your mom would believe you or be supportive?
Not that your mom, I think you told your mom,
[00:23:09] Jacob Rodman: not that she wouldn't believe me, I just, or you didn't wanna burden her or you didn't want her reaction? I just thought like. The world would keep spinning, you know, like things were going to keep going on. Like this was okay. Yeah. This was
[00:23:20] Uri Schneider: something you had to just endure and deal with.
Yeah. Um, like this as if it's not okay, but like this is the way life is. Mm-hmm. And, and Jacob's gotta learn how to like, definitely. Yeah. Toughen up. Um, that was the message you said to yourself?
[00:23:31] Jacob Rodman: I think so. At that time I was, you know, she kind of So
[00:23:34] Uri Schneider: somebody, your mom finds out about
[00:23:35] Jacob Rodman: it. Yeah. Friend. Hannah, when I was much younger, we were pretty close.
Told her mom. Mm-hmm. I was like, this is really messed up. Like this probably should have not have happened. Jacob, like Hannah didn't think,
[00:23:45] Uri Schneider: Hannah didn't think Jacob has to. Hannah was upset for me. Hannah didn't think Jacob has to endure this himself. Yeah.
[00:23:49] Jacob Rodman: And
[00:23:50] Uri Schneider: she tells her mom, her mom tells your
[00:23:51] Jacob Rodman: mom,
[00:23:52] Uri Schneider: her moms are
[00:23:52] Jacob Rodman: close.
And she told my mom like this happened. And Hannah talked to her on the phone, was like, this is, this is not okay. And however, a 12-year-old girl would say it, um, my mom went All Mama Bird kind of. Called the school.
[00:24:07] Uri Schneider: Momma bird? Momma bear.
[00:24:08] Jacob Rodman: Um, and I was
in science class the day later and I got called outta class and I don't wanna put this teacher on the spot or anything, but he calls me into his classroom and empty.
He had an off period and he's crying. He's visibly upset. He is. He looked like he was crying harder previously, and now he's still teary-eyed and upset for what he did to me. And he sat me down and I'm. 12 years old now feeling like I have to be the comforting force to this middle-aged man. And I'm sitting there as he please and apologizes to me for whatever external reason he felt like he needed to.
But I was confused in that moment, like, why is he doing this? I'm a kid. And I just kind of was like, it's okay. Like things happen. I understand. And he was like, I didn't understand what I was doing. I didn't realize. I think it is ignorance if he didn't. Know how it would affect me and he wanted me to improve.
And, um, but that was a pivotal moment. Like it was a pivotal moment in, in my life. And I, I remember that at the forefront of things versus other things that have happened and it's kind of he the power to,
[00:25:22] Uri Schneider: where did that leave you then, and where does it leave you now with that whole situation?
[00:25:27] Jacob Rodman: I was proud of my mother.
I Was you proud of your mom? I was a hundred percent proud of her. I was like. Wow. Like she's a tough little hooky. Like she's short blonde hair, very sweet woman will say hi to everybody and made this grown man cry. And I was like, wow. Like I'm proud to have her as my mom. Um, which, you know, I at that age don't think I was able to stand up for myself.
And she did. And that felt good not to see him cry or anything, but, but just, just to know that someone that I loved and cared about had my back as much as I cared about her. And I think that was huge.
[00:26:01] Uri Schneider: Wow. Yeah.
And what was the most helpful thing? Uh, so that was like a, that was like a, a challenging experience.
Yeah. What was like a formative lift or inflection point for you?
[00:26:16] Jacob Rodman: I think one that I could think about is my parents stopped when my parents stopped helping me, and it got to a point when I was getting older. They were pampering me and doing things to me and keeping me comfortable. And they're like, okay, Jacob, you're, you're, you're gonna have to start doing things.
Uh, and slowly they kind of eased me into it. And the first thing I remember was ordering at any restaurant establishment went to, and I strongly disliked doing that. I would just tell 'em to order for the whole table, which is quite common now. One person will do the whole order. So it kind of reversed from where I'm at now, and I'm usually the the person that will do that now.
But, um, that's kind of where it started. And then I got my driver's license. It was ordering in any drive-through setting, and I'd go with friends, five or six buddies in the car and I'd order for everybody. Um. I'm very proud of now to say at this moment I haven't stuttered at a drive-through in many years, and that's something that I'm proud of and I, I, I think that's important.
Restaurants, I don't stutter either, and these like the little things that I think about. I can now always order the food that I want to get. I now could always be comfortable in a meal and pushing the boundary, like of that comfort zone, especially when, when I was in high school.
I think there's more pivotal things that I've done now in college, but I remember talking to you when I was 18 and you asked what I wanted most outta my stutter. And I remember telling you I didn't want it to be the first thought when I walked in a room. I know that I'm always gonna have it. It's always gonna be something that is going to affect me for my day to day. And maybe it's once a week, maybe it's once a month, but it'll always be there.
Um, but I don't wanna walk into a room and it to be my biggest worry, my biggest thought. I don't wanna wake up every day and think of, I'm gonna have to do this and I might stutter, and I just want to go through my daily life. And it happens. It happens. If it doesn't, it doesn't. And I think we worked pretty aggressively on that, like making sure that I was confident with myself and not so much the techniques with speech, but just to like really internally believe that I could do these things. And I'm proud to say at this moment in my life, I had a networking event two days ago, a hundred people in a room, nice suit, nice tie, walking around.
I didn't think about my stutter once. I didn't stutter. Maybe a few blips here and there, but How old are you now? I'm 20. Um, so at
18, that, that was what you wanted? Yeah.
So it's
[00:28:36] Uri Schneider: another one of those,
[00:28:36] Jacob Rodman: um, look back, look forward moments like, and it's refreshing. Yeah. It is a hundred percent refreshing to not have it to, to not have, be the thing that you think about constantly.
Like when you wake up, when you go to bed and it's always gonna be there. Like I always understand that I'm content with that, but I don't want to think about it. Every room I walk into, every classroom, every conversation, and it's not anymore, which is huge.
[00:29:02] Uri Schneider: Um, what do you think? Uh, I'm thinking of some anecdotes we could dive into.
Yeah. What, what do you think was helpful? Like, helped you get to the point that at 18 it was, it was on the forefront? Yeah. It took front center stage in your mind and it kind of held you back from taking front stage mm-hmm. In terms of the way you wanted to live your life. And then you, you said it then very clearly.
I don't want it to be the first thing on my mind. And here you are. You know, and it's been some time now that, you know, going to a networking event and it's not even on your mind and it's certainly not the first thing on your mind. Mm-hmm. What do you think was, was the catalyst or the active ingredient to that?
[00:29:37] Jacob Rodman: So we both run, we're both long distance runners and I used to run well, a lot more than I
[00:29:43] Uri Schneider: for my age group. Yeah. I call it running. It would exactly, you know.
[00:29:47] Jacob Rodman: So
[00:29:47] Uri Schneider: hold up to your running. So
[00:29:49] Jacob Rodman: I ran competitively in high school and then going in into college. That was kind of was my dream of, to run D1 and eventually was able to accomplish, you know, those offers and things.
And the thing that I loved about running was the, there's some more technical stuff in it, but the more you run, the better you're gonna be. Like the, the more miles you put on your shoes, the better that the runner that, that you'll become. And I, I never was. The best with speech techniques and pausing and taking breaths and it, I never thought it really helped me as much as it does for other people, and it definitely does.
I think repetition is really where I derive my confidence from. Like, if I do this more than the person next to me, I'm more confident and I'm better. And going into finance, I, I had a whole story and planned out about this and it's that I wanted to.
[00:30:39] Uri Schneider: Wait, you know what? I wanna, I wanna hit pause on that.
Yeah. We'll hop, I wanna pull us back Yeah, please. To first meeting. Yeah. Where you come in. Yeah. We meet on the Upper West Side. Mm-hmm. It was the summer. Mm-hmm. It was a hot, humid, New York City day. Yeah. You walk in, if I'm not mistaken, you had flip flops. Yeah. Flip flop something on. Yeah. And then you've got like a hoodie over, college hoodie on.
Yeah. You got a college hoodie on. Yeah. And at the time I said to myself.
[00:31:06] Jacob Rodman: Is he
[00:31:06] Uri Schneider: sick? It's like 90 degrees
[00:31:07] Jacob Rodman: outside on Upper West. Everybody's sweating
[00:31:10] Uri Schneider: and you're walking in with a hoodie.
[00:31:11] Jacob Rodman: Yeah.
Um, I didn't want to say the college that I went to and I thought, you know, using sensory clues of people, they could see the big university on my chest and, uh, name tags do a great job of that too.
And just. You know, wearing a hat, something like that. It's not, so you were bringing like
[00:31:33] Uri Schneider: college swag. So if someone asked you what college you're going to, it made me
[00:31:36] Jacob Rodman: easier just to point or to kind of say, because they already internally knew. Um, and if I started to say it, that would kind of finish my sentence and it gave me some And you were ready
[00:31:44] Uri Schneider: to pay the price of kind of like looking, sweating on odd, sweating
[00:31:48] Jacob Rodman: on a summer, summer June day or whenever it was.
And I think it was July. Yeah, July hotter. It was even hotter then. Um, wild.
[00:31:55] Uri Schneider: So that's, that's where you were 18? The first time we met. And then that was a big thing, right? Like when you started dressing According to the season. Yes.
[00:32:02] Jacob Rodman: And not
[00:32:02] Uri Schneider: bringing, you know, extra layers. Swag, look at me. Swag. Look at you now.
[00:32:05] Jacob Rodman: Jeans and a nice, you know, top and you know, yeah, definitely a nice change from 18 to 20. I think my mom's happy
[00:32:10] Uri Schneider: about that. Totally. Yeah. Your mom was also, and she, she didn't even know why. Yeah. She just thought it was normal thing. Remember? She was like, because I, I thought, why are you wearing a hoodie?
Yeah. And she's like, I was wondering the same thing. Mm-hmm. You know? But she wanted to give you your independence. Yeah. She wanted dress you. Although she probably did. Yeah. Um, then there was that one time something stands out that we did with your mom, I, if you remember.
[00:32:29] Jacob Rodman: Yes. Uh, we went to Starbucks. So the big thing, I like to, that's a big moment for me.
Flip the script. Yeah,
[00:32:34] Uri Schneider: right. What, what was the prelude? Do you remember? Like how we set it up. So, because she kept saying like, yeah, what, why doesn't he do this? And would this be helpful? Yeah. And she meant really well. Yeah. Meant well very mom loves me. Yeah. But there's nothing like giving someone a chance to like try to stand in someone else's shoes.
Yeah.
[00:32:50] Jacob Rodman: It's very easy for someone that doesn't stutter to tell someone that stutters how to do things and how to go about their life. Like, Hey, why don't you just try.
[00:32:58] Uri Schneider: There's so many thoughts that they, we could extrapolate that to some, yeah. There's so many things. It's very easy for people who don't have that lived experience to tell someone else.
Yeah, why don't you just,
Hmm
[00:33:06] Jacob Rodman: a hundred percent. And we went to a Starbucks. We told her
[00:33:10] Uri Schneider: instead of you doing the strategies, yeah. We said, why don't we teach your mom how to stutter
[00:33:14] Jacob Rodman: and let's reverse it. And whatever she ordered, maybe it was a tea coffee, and you told her to have some blips to have. Maybe it was a five outta 10 stutter her.
[00:33:24] Uri Schneider: Yeah. You taught her. Taught her how to stutter and we like worked in the office. Yeah. Then we walked down the street and I said if she did it, we'd take her to the rooftop.
[00:33:30] Jacob Rodman: Yeah. And it was a beautiful rooftop. And we, and well before the rooftop went to Starbucks's whole line, so I remember it was like a five, 10 minute walk to Starbucks.
She's already getting nervous. She's already like, why do we have to to do this? Let's maybe. Bump it down to a three, not a stick. Embarra. Jacob maybe will make him nervous. And using these like other things to kind of just kind of like move out the situation.
[00:33:49] Uri Schneider: This confident, this confident, classy, incredibly strong mama bear.
Yeah. Turned into a nervous Nelly. Yeah.
[00:33:55] Jacob Rodman: And we walk into the Starbucks and it's like red flags everywhere. Sirens are a go. I can't do this. She's sweating. We're in line. She's like, guys stop. I understand. We don't. And she went up and she like. She lean, she shelled in. She kind of was like got close, didn't wanna anyone else, didn't to hear, gotta see.
And did like the smallest little stutter. I was like, come on mom, let's really like get into it. But it kind of showed her that like it's not just the moment of you talking to the person, it's the 30 minutes prior of you having to work yourself up and get the confidence and you know, practice in your head.
Like, what are you gonna say? And that's exhausting. Like there's a lot of endurance for you to. You know, EE everyday activities that are easy for someone to do. It takes you so much more emotional output and, and so much more stress and it's, it's hard. I, I think that's something that a, that a stutter gives you is like the endurance to just persevere through your speech and it is difficult to go through
a day when you know you're gonna stutter and just having to kind of push and to think and to wordsmith different words and to articulate different things in your head at a very fast pace. And nobody can say this then and this now to be more fluent. And it's a very difficult thing and people don't really have to go through that.
[00:35:09] Uri Schneider: And it's invisible.
[00:35:09] Jacob Rodman: A hundred percent. Yeah.
[00:35:11] Uri Schneider: So what happened on the other side of that?
[00:35:14] Jacob Rodman: I think
[00:35:14] Uri Schneider: like you said, it was a big, yeah,
[00:35:16] Jacob Rodman: I think she started to, I think we should do it again, to be fair. But let's go. I think. Internally, she kinda was like, there is more to this than I make it out to seem like if I tell him to go persevere and to try to do this, she knows I'm gonna shudder.
'cause she can hear the stutter, but she doesn't know what's going on behind the scenes. And now she does. I think she takes a little bit more of a cautious, like a cautious approach to these things now. 'cause he's like, all right, this is a lot. Like I understand it's a lot because I did the small little task of getting a hot tea at a Starbucks and.
I think that's a big thing is like, you put her in my shoes and I appreciate you for that, because I never would've thought to do that. And, um,
[00:36:00] Uri Schneider: what, so for her, it helped her appreciate all the stuff around Yeah. The talking moment. Yeah. What did it do for you that your mom suddenly, like, literally like viscerally went through the whole.
Lead up and like, and, and all, all the, all the Yeah. Odd things like talking quietly.
[00:36:17] Jacob Rodman: Yeah.
[00:36:17] Uri Schneider: Wanting to bail out, saying you're not thirsty when you really are.
[00:36:20] Jacob Rodman: Yeah.
[00:36:21] Uri Schneider: What did that do for you to see your mom kind of stand in those, in those situations and go through those motions and
[00:36:29] Jacob Rodman: It was in a sense, refreshing to kind of see her go through the difficulties that, that I went, like went through.
Like she's been the most supportive person in my life. Well, she's the best. My parents have both been amazing. Both the best and.
[00:36:41] Uri Schneider: And even the best people. Great. They really, it can be, it's easy to miss and hundred percent not fully appreciate the multiple layers Yes. Of the experience.
[00:36:51] Jacob Rodman: Um, it was just nice for her to internally recognize like what was going on.
And it was refreshing. It was nice for you. Yeah. And it was refreshing for me to see, okay. Like she now. In a small five minute span, knows what's going on, and she can step out of it now, now she's back to normal, right? She's good. She can go through daily life. She was very shaken
[00:37:10] Uri Schneider: up. She didn't bounce back so fast.
[00:37:11] Jacob Rodman: Um, but I think she, I think she realized, I think she said this when we sat back down in the office of like, he has to do this every single day of every single conversation. I did it for five minutes and it was so, it was so emotionally taxing and he has to go through this every single day. That's a, that's a, that, that's a rough thing to cope with.
I think. I, it's in interviews a lot, settings, I stutter. It makes me uncomfortable and it makes you uncomfortable. But after this 45 minute, 30 minute chat, we both go home. I still stutter. You don't, and it's, it's difficult for you to be there and to see it. It, I still have to go get dinner later. I still have to do this and have another interview and have a networking call, and I'm still gonna stutter and you're not gonna have to see it again.
That's something that a lot of people don't realize is like, my daily life is never, it's going to change slowly like year to year, but from a day-to-day basis, I'm going to stutter. It's going to be a big part of my life. And it was nice to kind of have her relax. It's gonna be a part of it. Yeah. Big, small, big part, small, you know, medium.
But it was nice for her to kind of realize. That it is more than what I make it out to seem.
[00:38:19] Uri Schneider: I, I kind of remember at the end of our first meeting, correct me if I'm wrong. Mm-hmm. But one of the, one of the things that you appreciated was just her beginning to appreciate Yeah. We didn't do that the first meeting, but the way we worked was to, to make it less about like, um, okay, we're here to put the burden on, or take the burden off, uh, Jacob by just loading up what he needs to do, but really like appreciating the totality of it and how.
The conversational dyad, the different people in the picture can all be part of it. What was the, um, what you said about the look, just a, a thought that I had was the look is often a look of pity.
[00:38:57] Jacob Rodman: Mm-hmm.
[00:38:57] Uri Schneider: Like, oh, they feel bad. It's like, oh yeah, I feel bad for you. As opposed to like empathy. Like, oh, okay.
Like, which I think was what I was trying to do with your, with your mom or with anyone, is like, it's not to say. Have pity, but more like if you could empathize, if you could connect with what this person's going through. Yeah. First of all, you could have more respect for them. Mm-hmm. Not pity. You could recognize how strong they are for doing all the things they do.
Yeah. And those everyday things that you do and take for granted for them. Like for you, it costs what? Like a dollar for them, it's like a hundred dollars effort. Mm-hmm. To do those everyday things and you have more respect for people.
[00:39:34] Jacob Rodman: Definitely.
[00:39:35] Uri Schneider: What do you think of that
[00:39:37] Jacob Rodman: pity versus empathy? I get the look a lot.
Yeah. It's definitely a. Big part of any sutter's life. Mm. They're always gonna get that luck. Mm. From age one to age a hundred, everyone's gonna see it. And
it's, I don't know why it relates to me in this way, but it's, I get it a lot in my networking interview calls. Um, it's a very corporate but, and upsetting.
[00:40:01] Uri Schneider: Guy who stutters does a lot of interview networking calls. Maybe there's a good moment to Yeah. Yeah. Unpause what you were gonna say before you decided in college.
[00:40:07] Jacob Rodman: So I decided in college when I, I knew, I knew what I wanted. I didn't as any college 'cause they don't entirely know what they want to do. But I knew I wanted to be part of an industry that was fast-paced, difficult, hard, and had smart people around it. I wanted to grow and I think my brain is a tool and I wanna exercise that tool.
Um, and finance is truthfully a good way to do all these things and to make money doing it. So, kind of fit all those boxes. The things I wanted to do. I didn't know what I wanted to do in the financial industry, though. I, I knew that I wanted to be in it, but I didn't really know what I wanted to do. So I set a goal for myself for two main reasons, was for the first one to figure out what I wanted to do, but to also speak like I had a very hard time speaking to people.
And I wanted to go out there and to talk. So I set a goal for myself, a hundred networking meetings of calls. A lot of them were in person driving back from Greenwich and Darien and Westport and Manhattan, and just back and forth everywhere and having Zoom calls and team calls, a hundred meetings. How much time?
Uh, one semester I started. mid-January. I actually crossed that goal right around mid, mid-April. So it was shorter than a full semester. Three months? Yeah. Three months. Mm-hmm. And roughly as of to a call every day, month call every day. That's right, that's right. Do the math. Um, I remember my, uh, spring break was a week long and I had five calls every day for a week straight.
I just packed the schedule. That was a lot.
[00:41:28] Uri Schneider: But I think then you told me afterwards it made more sense to like cap out, like to do three, two to three. Yeah. Two to
[00:41:32] Jacob Rodman: three. Four was really pushing. And if five was extreme, um. For me, my first 20 or 30 calls was anyone that was willing to just say, yes, it could be investment, banking, wealth and management.
It could be insurance, it could be pe, it could be anything. I wanted just to talk to people and
[00:41:51] Uri Schneider: putting in the reps, putting the masks, reps in the shoes,
[00:41:53] Jacob Rodman: and I got to talk about different areas in wealth. It was, there was some management roles. As I said, there was some investment banking and just anyone that was really willing to have that conversation and I stuttered.
It was rough. It was, it was, it was there as present. I was nervous. I remember my first call was like, why don't, like why am I doing this? This is, this is, this is very self-inflicted pain. Like, I'm like, I don't have to reach out and do this. But as I said, I feel that I get better through just constant repetition.
Um. Then I started to kind of merge into the debt side of thing. So the last 60 70 calls were asset backed finance, yellows, crunching, other loans. Private credit is like my bread and butter of what I'm interested in, uh, public credit, like l fin, all these different kind of niche areas that I like. And these guys gave me a lot of time they would sit down with me and they would break down things with me for an hour, two hours.
Um, and I felt appreciated. Like I felt those, those, those guys were cerebral and they were smart and they just gave me the time. From call one to call a hundred got drastically better. And it, it, it, it just proved to me, and it, and it showed me that through repetition, like you can't accomplish anything.
And I think there's a conceptually simple idea of if you tell yourself you're going to do something and you know that you're gonna do it regardless of how you feel, and you're going to want it a little bit more than the day you did yesterday and the day before, you will accomplish like what you want.
The goal that, the goal that you set for yourself, like, and there's a, there's an internal piece in knowing that and knowing that, like, I didn't know how I was gonna get to a hundred, but I knew how I would get to one and then I knew how I get to two. I didn't, I didn't have it all planned out, but I knew from one carried to two, carried to three.
And that's like, I use this term a lot, just laying the bricks. Like, you have this wall, this house in your imagination. You don't know what you're gonna. Like, you don't know how you're gonna build that wall, but you just have to lay a brick and every brick lays a foundation for the next brick on top of it.
And then eventually you, you will have that wall. And I think the interviewers, and people just love that analogy as well, but it really is important to kind of like, just like, just like preface that, that it, like if you have a stutter, if you are going through things like, and you are motivated to change, I can't promise you that it's going to be better tomorrow or in a year.
But If you work on the things that you don't want to work on, 'cause they're hard and 'cause they scare you and they're frustrating, I promise you that they will get better. Like, I think I'm a living example of it. Um, and that's the 10 year just, just like, just like motivator, being 10 years old and knowing that I couldn't, and now I can, and what can I do when I'm 30?
I think that's gets, I think that's what gets me up every day, just motivates me to be better. And it's kind of where I'm, you know. Great. Yeah. Going with that, we come to
[00:44:38] Uri Schneider: the end. We, you know, we met an interesting time. Mm-hmm. You had a lot of speech therapy in your life Yes. Before that with great people.
Um, what was your experience or what stood out to you in the work that we did during that, that summer? That hot summer? Yeah.
[00:44:51] Jacob Rodman: One thing I remember, I was emotionally drained, physically drained. After our calls I, or our meetings, we'd have these long, long meetings, two hours upwards longer, and. I was like, ah, I don't want to, I don't wanna talk.
I, I don't wanna go out and do these things. But we worked a lot. I, I got a lot of what we, we did from confidence. Like I derived a lot of our conversations in the growth I gained from my confidence and which you helped me do. And I remember had a date, I don't know if you remember this, this is a, a big moment.
We had a Friday morning meeting and I wasn't so confident when it came to things prior. And that's the big reason why I came to you and. I had a date. It was, we had a morning, a Friday morning meeting, Thursday night. I knew the girl quite well, so it wasn't like I was a stranger to her, but it was getting a little late.
I was like, I gotta get home. I've got speech therapy in the morning. And she's like, what? I was like, yeah, I, you know, as you know, I've got a stutter and you know, I work on it. So I've got, I've got speech therapy at nine in the morning, eight in the morning, whenever it was, and it's like, this is a lot. So I kind of gotta, you know.
I kinda gotta go and she, and she kind of laughed it off and understood and I saw her again after. So it, it didn't end there, but just like people don't want it to tell people that they care about that they have a stutter. And I was able to tell a girl that I was trying to impress that. Like, I, hey, like I had to go, 'cause I, I've got speech therapy in the morning.
I think that was a big moment that I didn't internally like recognize is that like my confidence grew that much that I could tell a girl that I liked, that I had speech therapy. If I could tell a girl that I like and if I can talk to a global head on Wall Street or an MD or someone super senior that is intimidating and I wanna impress, I can talk to anybody.
Amazing. Yeah.
[00:46:32] Uri Schneider: What would be a word of encouragement to someone who feels like they've been there, done that? They tried so many things. They feel kind of hopeless and they're, they're, they're considering doing something, but they're kind of on the fence.
[00:46:43] Jacob Rodman: Yeah. I'll make this one quick, 'cause I, I had a friend call me a couple days ago and he just switched his major to finance and he wanted to kind of.
Do a similar networking call learning thing of just, you know, reading your newsletters, reading articles, and just, you know, just like stacking those bricks, as I said before. And he told me, Jake, I'm feeling really, really unmotivated. I don't feel like I'm getting anywhere with, with the things I'm doing.
And he started maybe a month prior and had probably 15 calls today and he's doing a phenomenal job and, and learning. And I was driving somewhere, maybe I was driving back from class or lunch and I was like, okay, call him up. I'm like, Hey buddy, I got 10 minutes, let's walk through this. And I told him.
That the opportunity that you get that internship, the opportunity that you get that offer and you see it with people that are famous and athletes and that winning goal. You see the big pivotal moment, the big change and the important thing in front of you, but you don't see the hours and the constant work that you had to put like just, just like the behind the scenes action and the things you've done to therefore be prepared for that moment.
It often seems that the interview and the offer you get seems so easy. You're like, like, why did I just reach out to this company first? Why? Like, it seems so, the offer I had this past summer for my internship was the easiest offer that I got. It lasted two conversations and I had the offer, and I've been in interviews for eight rounds and I haven't got the job.
And I was like, this one seems so easy. But I wouldn't have been prepared for that if I didn't have those a hundred calls. And like I, I. I can guarantee you, like, there are going to be days that feel like you're getting nowhere. Um, I think this word is important. Um, I think the main thing I got from my stutter is just the ability to, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, endure and my definition of the word endure is the ability to go through long-term suffering and pain with.
With little to no negative change and with a stutter, has to wake up every single day knowing that they're gonna stutter, still do their daily activities, speak, and go to class and do their job and talk to their wife or their kids or their friends. And I think that's an important thing to like realize is like you have the tools, you have been molded and presented, you know, this set of things is going to prepare you to therefore do this task.
And I think that's the most important thing is like I was able to do these a hundred calls. I've done hard things like I stutter every single day. I can go tomorrow and I can stutter again. And I think it's an example of like, I'm here now talking to you. I just had my first, you know, major beli, major stutter, and I can persevere.
I, I, I could push through it and I think that's an important a hundred percent I can endure. Um, that's an important thing that I think stutters need to realize. And this is my last kind of point, I think is important. I didn't hear it from someone that had a stutter. I heard it elsewhere and I can't pinpoint where.
But you need to learn the thing that you dislike most about yourself and to angle the stutter, to become a pro and not a con, and understand that the things that you're gonna get from your stutter are going to outweigh the things that you don't. Um, I think that's an important thing, and like just the internal confidence in knowing that like, I have these set of skills that have been molded and cultivated from this disability, from this hardship, or from something that has been set on you.
Now I can take on the world. I think that's a important thing.
[00:50:10] Uri Schneider: Thank you for this conversation. Of course. Thank you for having me. You are wise beyond your years. Thank you. And I can't wait to see what the future Thank you. What the next 10 years look like for you?
[00:50:19] Jacob Rodman: This was fun. Awesome. Had a good time
[00:50:21] Uri Schneider: till next time?
Yes.
[00:50:22] Jacob Rodman: I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, share it with a friend, and if you wanna get more tips and follow us for more insights, check out transcendingx.com/email And remember, keep talking.